So this is Progressive Thought?

by A Patriot, Fri Sep 22, 2006 at 11:14:17 PM EST

I'm disgusted by this fascist diary

"Shut Your F*cking Pie Hole: 2006 Version"

All of Daily Kos and the progressive, democratic, and liberal bloggasphere should be ashamed of this type of behavior. This diary should be renounced by Kos himself on the front page and its author needs to make a public apology, also on the front page. The fact that those at Daily Kos or any other blog condone this behavior is appalling. And don't tell me how Dkos regulates itself, that's a load of crap and everyone knows it. I and other's here have been auto-banned by these very same types and it's disgusting. What is the argument? That this author, someone with a four (4) digit user ID can have free reign to post this and threaten other's with NeoCon tactics but other's maybe too new or too low on the food chain have to shut up and take it? I'm disgusted by this behavior and I'm calling on all of you to make a statement about this to Kos and any other Front Pager over there. No action is the same as condoning this behavior. Would you let the NeoCons get away with this?

Guess MyDD isn't much better when an editor alters a poll to fit his sense of what's right to post. So sad.

So it is very clear, the "This is MyDD,not Dailykos" choice was added without my concent. That, IMHP, is censorship at work.

Here's the LINK to the diary

And from the offensive diarist himself:


Now, I know Daily Kos is populated with many people who have been disappointed with the Democratic Party for one reason or the other over the past 6 years, if not the past 16 years.     I know some of you have your issues with some conservative candidates we are running in Pennsylvania, Tennessee and Virginia.  

However, at risk of being called a dicatator who wishes to deprive you of your freedom of speech, now is not the time for the airing of your past or present grievances.  

It is 48 days until the elections.  Our slate of candidates are set.  We have alot of ground work to do to get out the vote.   So now is the time for you to work on that, for surely you would rather Democrats win in 48 days than Republicans, no matter what your disagreement.

If I see any type of "concern troll" comments talking about how the Democratic Party has lost it way or that certain candidates are either too liberal or too conservative to garner their support, I will not investigate whether such sentiments are genuine or not.  I will assume they are Republican or Green concern trolls who wish us ill.  And I will troll rate them.   If I see a diary entitled "I hate the Democratic Party," I will troll rate the comments supportive of it therein.  Whether the "concern" comes from the right or left, such comments have no place on Daily Kos this close to an election.   Such comments aid the Republicans and do not help the Democrats.

And my comments are not just aimed to new users or fraudulent users here on Daily Kos, but also are aimed to certain disappointing Senators and other professional pundits.  Senator Obama and his comments about the Democratic Party recently come to mind.  Yes, I am calling Senator Obama a concern troll who is no better than Kean campaign spokeswoman Jill Hazelbaker and her many sockpuppets.


Poll
Does this diarist owe us all an apology?
Yes
No

Votes: 689
Results : Vote Link : Polls


Tags: Concern Troll, fascist, DKos (all tags)

Display:
Permalink :: 62 Comments :: Post a Comment


That diary was written on Dailykos (3.00 / 2)

This is not Dailykos. This is MyDD. Take this somehwere else.
by Chris Bowers on Fri Sep 22, 2006 at 11:49:30 PM EST

Re: That diary was written on Dailykos (none / 0)

Amen. Nothing more needs to be said.


by PsiFighter37 on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 12:24:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That diary was written on Dailykos (none / 0)

Nothing more needs to be said.

I hope that's not just another way of saying, "Shut Your F*cking Pie Hole."


With Democrats Lieberman goes for the jugular. With Republicans he goes for the lips.
by Sitkah on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 03:16:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That diary was written on Dailykos (none / 0)

NO, just a suncinct agreement with the previous poster's sentiment that this doesn't belong here.


by elessar on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 05:10:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That diary was written on Dailykos (2.00 / 2)

Trying to say what belongs where or when sounds like "shut your pie-hole" to me.


With Democrats Lieberman goes for the jugular. With Republicans he goes for the lips.
by Sitkah on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 07:16:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That diary was written on Dailykos (none / 0)

There is no such thing as "DKos." Only select individuals who are targeted by the Office of Special Plans are duped into thinking that that "site" even exists for the rest of the world.
by blues on Sun Sep 24, 2006 at 04:26:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That diary was written on Dailykos (none / 0)

I'll keep it under my hat.


With Democrats Lieberman goes for the jugular. With Republicans he goes for the lips.
by Sitkah on Sun Sep 24, 2006 at 12:39:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That diary was written on Dailykos (none / 0)

There were good points in the diary but I had the same thought. Maybe the diarist should crosspost.


by liberal atheist on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 11:02:55 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Thanks (none / 0)

for the input. you covered both sides well, as any thoughtful and intelligent person should do. THIS is what sets us apart from the NeoCons. You are a shinning example of my point. While you agree the diary should not be here, you acknowledged my points and the fact that I have a right to post them. Thanks again.


"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe." - Albert Einstein
by A Patriot on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 02:05:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That diary was written on Dailykos (none / 0)

Exactly. I come here so I can avoid Dkos.


Jeremy Bentham sucks!!
by Forward with Feingold on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 04:06:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

To you sir (none / 0)

I apologize for putting you through this, but i feel it needs to be noted and action should be taken. Again, sorry for subjecting you to more Kos than cared for.


"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe." - Albert Einstein
by A Patriot on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 06:08:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That diary was written on Dailykos (none / 0)

Changing the poll was pretty juvenile on someone's part.


With Democrats Lieberman goes for the jugular. With Republicans he goes for the lips.
by Sitkah on Sun Sep 24, 2006 at 12:43:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So this is Progressive Thought? (3.00 / 2)

This is not Dailykos. This is MyDD. Take this somehwere else.

MyDD does the same.  I know.  Happened to me.

I have been a registered Democrat longer than most here have been alive and was told to stop bashing Democrats or post elsewhere.

It is that kind of censorship that is most helpful to Republicans.

Everybody here glad Zell Miller was a Democratic senator?

Best,  Terry


by terryhallinan on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 05:55:34 AM EST

Re: So this is Progressive Thought? (none / 0)

I don't know your situation but have you ever stopped to think that maybe it's not what you say but how you say it?


Dare to be free.
by misscee on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 09:50:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]

WTF (none / 0)

Does that have to do with a friggin' thing? Talk about an inappropriate comment. Maybe you should look at the way you made your statement. A very condecending tone indeed.


"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe." - Albert Einstein
by A Patriot on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 02:09:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: WTF (3.00 / 1)

It has a lot to do with a lot of things.  If you aren't being constructive with your criticism, then it doesn't contribute anything.


by Lucas O'Connor on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 03:13:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: WTF (none / 0)

Totally agree, Lucas.


by elessar on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 05:11:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I believe calling out this type (none / 0)

of endemic behavior is very constrcutive and called for. He is but one of many at that site whom abuse their position. Following your logic, why call out Sore Loseman, or Rove, or Cheney, or Bush?


"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe." - Albert Einstein
by A Patriot on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 06:13:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I believe calling out this type (none / 0)

which is fine. I haven't seen your past posts so I don't know how you phrased it one way or the other.  But the tone and phrasing is relevant.


by Lucas O'Connor on Sun Sep 24, 2006 at 02:44:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Lucas (none / 0)

At some point in an argument the best phrase may just be "you're an asshole." I don't mean you or your comments here, but when you've debated a point with someone and presented links, facts, and cogent arguments, then in return get rhetoric, opinion, and ad hominem attacks, "Fuck You" is sometimes the best and most accurate response. I debated Assrocket from Powerline Blog and posted a diary about it on dKos which you can read HERE. All he did was spout his bullshit. I see many of the same traits on so-called liberal blogs. If anyone should be troll rated, it should be these types which, as I understand the concept of the troll rating, is what it was meant for in the first place. It was not intended to be like an infectious disease, muting into "concern troll" "purity troll" and all that other crap. Whoever thought of that was someone with too much time on their hands and, unfortunately, the tinge of power needed to make it a reality.


"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe." - Albert Einstein
by A Patriot on Sun Sep 24, 2006 at 03:12:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: WTF (none / 0)

Plus I wan't even talking to the Patriot. Maybe s/he should learn to follow a thread.


Dare to be free.
by misscee on Tue Sep 26, 2006 at 09:34:35 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Then we'll have to agree to disagree <nt> (none / 0)


Dare to be free.
by misscee on Tue Sep 26, 2006 at 09:32:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So this is Progressive Thought? (3.00 / 2)

I don't know your situation but have you ever stopped to think that maybe it's not what you say but how you say it?

That can mean a lot of things.  I am fully willing to admit that I generally aim at a somewhat higher level than those who understand only one- or two-syllable cuss words.

The problem really is that there are those who wish not to listen to dissent of any kind.

"I don't belong to an organized party. I am a Democrat." - Will Rogers

Goose-stepping Republicans have always been better at keeping the faithful in line.  It might be best if Democrats do not continue to attempt to ape the Republicans.  Republicans Lite under Clinton with the message "We are Republicans too only less so" lost Congress, the people and eventually even the White House to a moron.

Better to keep those who think in the Democratic Party in my opinion.  The people will then follow again.

Best,  Terry


by terryhallinan on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 02:15:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

To Clarify (3.00 / 1)

My statement was aimed at the person criticizing you, just to be clear. I don't think your tone was condescending at all.


"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe." - Albert Einstein
by A Patriot on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 02:19:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So this is Progressive Thought? (none / 0)

The problem really is that there are those who wish not to listen to dissent of any kind.

Welcome to life.  Being condescending about it isn't likely to fix the problem.


by Lucas O'Connor on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 03:14:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So this is Progressive Thought? (none / 0)

Welcome to life.

I have been living a very long time, Lucas.  Many would say too long.  Throwing out non sequiturs to attack an argument has appeal for many but maybe is only a waste of bandwidth.

This old person remembers a day when the Democratic Party had grown so dominant that Jimmy Hoffa was taken halfway serious when he proposed that the Teamsters take over the Republican Party.  Many pundits fretted that Republicans were providing no serious challenges.  

The Democrats didn't become dominant by suppressing dissent.  They lost it all by doing exactly that.

Those who wish to remake the Democratic Party in the image of the Republicans as Clinton and the DLC prescribed have a prescription for continuing second-class status.  Why blame the media for following?

There are many hopeful signs that the tide is turning, most notably the Lamont victory that may or may not be sealed in November.  It might be noted that Lamont has made a real difference whatever the future holds.  Electing troglodytes elsewhere to gain a majority in the House and/or Senate would not necessarily be wholly beneficial. Look what Lieberman has done to the Democratic Party throughout his political life.

Best,  Terry


by terryhallinan on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 04:18:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So this is Progressive Thought? (3.00 / 1)

The point isn't suppression. The point is being productive.  There's a valuable place for constructive criticism.  If you're going to complain that not everyone agrees with you all the time, well- get over it, cause it happens.

It is the position of ONE author of ONE diary on dailykos that it's time to save up the criticism until November 9 and just focus on the positive impact we can have on getting Democratic candidates elected.  It's not official progressive policy, it isn't mandated by the blog gods, it's one person.

Quite frankly, while I don't agree with the tactics used by the author, it would be very nice to give more time to the evils of Republicans and drop a few of the "Democratic leadership can't get the sun elected at the beach" diaries.  Because for the most part, we all know that and usually they don't come with anything productive to DO to improve the situation between now and election day.

The best way to change how the leadership behaves is to elect new leaders.  Thank goodness bloggers are out there to educate the rest of the world on the NEED for that change, but we've gotta get fresh blood elected for that to happen.  I'm no big fan of Obama for example, but I really don't need to read anything more about him in the next two months.  Let's substitute the asshole things that Bob Corker, Mike Dewine, George Allen, Linc Chafee, Bob Santorum and all the others say.  There's 100 times more of it.  And it's THAT sort of information that can be taken by blog readers, distilled and massaged, and delivered to friends, family, neighbors and coworkers.  Which translates into increased awareness, activism, motivation, votes, and Democrats in office.

I certainly agree that reform within the party is of vital importance.  But we can't reform the party too much between now and November 8.  We can sure as hell reform the country's government though.  Let's burn down the top dogs, but let's do it when it's the best way to spend our energy.  Right now, at least in the minds of many, it's second best.


by Lucas O'Connor on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 04:33:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So this is Progressive Thought? (none / 0)

The point isn't suppression.

That is precisely the point.  

we can't reform the party too much between now and November 8.

We can avoid trying to suppress dissent as you are doing.  It does no good whatever in my opinion to demand that only Republicans be attacked. Reaganism doesn't work for Democrats and doesn't do so hot with the goose stepping Republicans we are confronting either.

Best,  Terry


by terryhallinan on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 04:44:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So this is Progressive Thought? (3.00 / 1)

I'm not suppressing anything. I'm asking what you hope to accomplish between now and November 8 via criticism of the Democratic Party that will be MORE productive than using that time and energy to criticize Republican candidates.


by Lucas O'Connor on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 04:59:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So this is Progressive Thought? (none / 0)

I'm asking what you hope to accomplish between now and November 8 via criticism of the Democratic Party

I am not criticizing the Democratic Party.  I criticize only those who forget what the Democratic Party stands for and would remake it into the Republican Lite Party.

Are you sure you are in the right party? :-)

BTW I am grateful to those who recommended this diary.  You see, Lucas, there are good Democrats who don't mind a bit of crosstalk and discussion.  Reading from the catechism belongs to Bible classes or Republican confabs.

Take care, Lucas.  I know you mean well.

Best,  Terry


by terryhallinan on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 05:09:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So this is Progressive Thought? (none / 0)

Well it's quite clear to me, that you shouldn't be told to post elsewhere.  I will be looking forward to your posts from now on.

Regards.


Dare to be free.
by misscee on Tue Sep 26, 2006 at 09:37:04 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So this is Progressive Thought? (3.00 / 2)

I am not registered at DKos, but I did see that post and thought pretty much the same thing as the author of this post. I also saw what the author of the DKos post was angry about.

There has to be some sort of balance.

I don't think anyone here or at any progressive site will deny that the Democrats have done a mediocre job at best, and immediately after 9/11 simply rolled over and let the Republicans have free reign to dismantle our Constitution. They did nothing to stop the hero worship of Bush, nor put out the truth that Bush/Cheney incompetence allowed 9/11 to happen. A few brave souls stood up, Feingold, Clarke, etc. But if the Democrats hadn't been cowed we wouldn't be fighting an uphill battle now to get the truth of the situation out, the myth of Bush the protector had become the truth. It should have never happened.

I also understand why people are afraid of demoralizing the voters. But there are two things going on here, the criticism of the people, AND the lack of action on Democrats part. You can't say it is all the fault of the critics. That's why I say there has to be balance.

The Democrats have to give people reason to vote. They have abandoned many of their core constituencies, and it's been a losing strategy. As Democrats we have all sat back and been complacent. We allowed them to smear labor as greedy and corrupt, but give management a pass...and we have low wages, offshoring, loss of health care as a result. We allowed them to smear minorities as chronic welfare recipients driving cadillacs and popping out babies every other day...and we have a major upswing in racism and loss of civil rights gains for everyone. We allowed them to smear environmentalists as granola chewing tree huggers...and how's that global warming working out for you? Nice prices at the gas pumps too.

If the point of the criticism is to get the Democrats to grow a spine and stand up for what is right, not pander like the Republicans do, but do what is right, then I think it is healthy. If the point is to just vent and say, "Democrats suck!" then I think the posts are useless and should be removed.


by TripleJ63 on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 11:53:08 AM EST

Re: So this is Progressive Thought? (none / 0)

I agree with your sentiment about balance. I would add that, in calling certain dems out for being spineless, we should also point to dems WITH spines, not only to prevent voter demoralization (may increase voter envy though) but also to offer constructive examples of what dems SHOULD be. So that, as an example, when Montanans (sp?) are upset with Max Baucus, they can look to Jon Tester as an example.


by elessar on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 05:22:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So this is Progressive Thought? (none / 0)

Oh I know. I'm in Wisconsin and I did mention Feingold in my post. LOL I wish Kohl could take a lesson or two from him although I have very little complaints about him compared to my Representative...Sensenbrenner! I doubt Bryan Kennedy has a chance in the election, lots of Republicans here, I checked after the primaries and there was something like 66 or 67% identifying as Republican in Ozaukee County.


by TripleJ63 on Sun Sep 24, 2006 at 01:21:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So this is Progressive Thought? (2.33 / 3)

From the "shut up" deiary on dKos....

However, at risk of being called a dicatator who wishes to deprive you of your freedom of speech, now is not the time for the airing of your past or present grievances.

And Lieberman says we're not supposed to criticize Bush during his so called war.

An excuse to tell other people to shut up rather than going to the trouble of trying to refute them can always be found.

As for this kos diarist, like Bush, he's just a wannabe dictator who can shout till he's blue, but he isn't going to shut up those he disagrees with.

And, BTW, some Democrats DO suck.


With Democrats Lieberman goes for the jugular. With Republicans he goes for the lips.
by Sitkah on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 01:46:28 PM EST

Re: So this is Progressive Thought? (3.00 / 1)

Yes, but there's diminishing returns from criticism as election day approaches.  Eventually, the course we're on is the course we're stuck with whether it's preferable or not.  Criticizing it isn't going to change anything in time to matter at the ballotbox, so it just ends up being divisive and distracting. I'm hardly going to suggest there's no place for criticism, but couple it with how to improve.

For example, as referenced in the Dkos diary, complaining about how liberal our candidates are(n't) is completely pointless since we've got em for better or worse.  Instead of just complaining about Dem leadership not taking a hard enough line as the referenced diary does, provide some phone numbers to call, some suggestions on how to volunteer on campaigns that will improve the caliber of Democrats in DC, etc.

It's hollow criticism that really ends up getting stuck in craws.


by Lucas O'Connor on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 03:19:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Sorry Lucas (none / 0)

but you missed the forest for the trees. making a unilateral top-down decision on a site that isn't even yours, that sounds like more like NeoCon, is not going to help anybody, anywhere, at anytime. He was giving orders. Go check out the diary by TheBlaz. He's ashamed of the diarist's behavior. I think more should be too. We expect elected officials or others in the public eye to give a public apology when they go off. Why? Because their words, like those of a high profile user, carry more weight. This is a perfect example. If my words really carried any weight, the diarist would have either apologized or created an entire diary to challenge me. Neither has happened.


"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe." - Albert Einstein
by A Patriot on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 03:46:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Sorry Lucas (none / 0)

That guy doesn't have the power to make a unilateral decision about anything.  All he was saying is what HE was going to do.  He isn't enforcing the behavior of others.


by Lucas O'Connor on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 04:02:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

See my previous comment (none / 0)

As stating it again would is redundant.


"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe." - Albert Einstein
by A Patriot on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 06:15:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So this is Progressive Thought? (3.00 / 1)

I say let people say what they want. Agree, refute, or ignore, but don't tell people when to talk or what to say -- or at least don't expect it to have any effect whatsoever except to demonstrate  intolerance.

I'll say what I want about any Democrat, Republican, or "other"  and their party right up to election day and beyond. And that's just the way it is.


With Democrats Lieberman goes for the jugular. With Republicans he goes for the lips.
by Sitkah on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 07:14:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Isn't it amazing (none / 0)

that those who are given a tinge of power almost always abuse way beyond their actual authority or scope? A perfect example is the "editor" adding a question to my poll, which I have since deleted. After all, it is my diary.


"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe." - Albert Einstein
by A Patriot on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 07:46:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Isn't it amazing (3.00 / 1)

I'm guessing that the added question was the third one -- about leaving it on dkos?

To me it's relevant to post that diary here since there are people on this blog who do the same thing except they don't directly say "shut up".

Some try to discredit a diary or post by calling its author "troll" (that putdown is SO yesterday).

Some say it isn't the right time or place for the truth.

And some claim that only party-line activists have any right to express their opinions.

They certainly have a right so say those things anytime and anyplace they want. And others certainly have the right to ignore, refute, or agree with them. I usually choose to refute and sometimes ignore, but I never agree with them.


With Democrats Lieberman goes for the jugular. With Republicans he goes for the lips.
by Sitkah on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 08:17:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Exactly (none / 0)

The difference between here and every other blog, and DKos is that people keep it civil because the same CHUMs that would troll hunt you on Dkos dare not reveal who they are over here, or act like they do over there. They know the community as a whole would shut their ass down in a hurry. Over there they have some power. Outside of there they aren't shit. How do I know? Not one of them have come outside of the community to ever challenge me on anything. Those few who have commented with comments resembling a CHUM commentator from Dkos never keep up the fight once logic comes into the argument. They can't hack logic and so they crumble and probably run away back to Dkos to go troll rate somebody who can't stand up to themselves.


"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe." - Albert Einstein
by A Patriot on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 08:43:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Exactly (none / 0)

Fortunately, I'm immune from troll ratings since I never give them to others or notice them if given to me. I don't even understand how it works or it's purpose. People rating each others seems creepy to me.


With Democrats Lieberman goes for the jugular. With Republicans he goes for the lips.
by Sitkah on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 09:44:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So this is Progressive Thought? (none / 0)

You never know. It seemed to me that Clinton's response to Path to 9/11 until he realized that ordinary citizens were fed up with this b.s. and were calling their local stations, senators, papers, etc.

I think telling them Iraq and torture are big issues might get them to include that in campaigning instead of just the economy. Although I actually agree that they should run on the economy too. Complaining that they are avoiding or ignoring important issues might get them to change strategy and help get them elected.


by TripleJ63 on Sun Sep 24, 2006 at 01:26:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So this is Progressive Thought? (none / 0)

Seems my brain is working faster than my fingers, I meant to say that Clinton's first response to Path to 9/11 was wishy washy, but got more aggressive when he saw he wasn't alone, part of that was anger towards his wishy washy response. Yes, I know he isn't running for election. LOL But what I am trying to say is that if enough of us push and shove sometimes you see some action with politicians.


by TripleJ63 on Sun Sep 24, 2006 at 01:28:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So this is Progressive Thought? (none / 0)


"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe." - Albert Einstein
by A Patriot on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 03:47:23 PM EST

Disregard above. Accidental post n/t (none / 0)


"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe." - Albert Einstein
by A Patriot on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 03:48:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I am always amazed (none / 0)

when someone talks about supression on DKos.  Because DKos is nothing but gigantic argument.

If you go there now you will find plenty of posts blasting Democrats.

I have been posting on DKos since Sept 2002.  I was not for Dean, disgree with 90% of what the posters say on economics, and had an extended argument with Armando about his treatment of poster who he disagrees with.  

In over 4 years I have been troll rated once.

My guess is an objective reading of your comments would show that some of the stuff you complain about you brought on yourself.


by fladem on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 09:25:13 PM EST

Typical (none / 0)

blame the person who gets banned because they must be at fault. What shortsightedness on your part. So typical of the "Kos" mentality I find there. If you've been on there since 2002 than your Used ID is probably what, in the tree or four digit range? Ever consider that's why no one dare troll rated you. You know my user ID on DKos, the same as here. What's yours?


"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe." - Albert Einstein
by A Patriot on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 09:31:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Just as I thought (none / 0)

User ID 932. Don't you get it yet? No one there would dare to troll rate you unless they were in your same "peer group" for "fear" of being troll hunted. I tell you what, get another id, a new one, and post anonymously some of the same things you'd post and see how long it takes the likes of the CHUM to come and start calling you a troll. Try it. get a whiff of what it's like to be in the real DKos world where User ID means everything. In fact, you could even make comment with a user ID in the 100,000 range, then troll rate it with your fladem ID, and see how long it takes for the CHUM to swarm. Please, prove me wrong.


"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe." - Albert Einstein
by A Patriot on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 09:37:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Just as I thought (none / 0)

Who owns MyDD.com?  Who owns DailyKos?

Don't know precisely who owns MyDD.com, but whoever does put Messrs. Bowers, Armstrong, Stoller, Singer, etc., in charge.  I suspect that among them (or their LLCs) are the owners.  We are here at the sufferance of management.  When they get tired of us, they may ban us, or regulate us in the interim.  Where else can we post?  Anywhere public space, or set up your own private space.  MyDD.com is not City Hall or the Boston Commons.  Neither is my own site crablaw.com.  Kos Media LLC (i.e. Kos, in substance) owns DailyKos.com.

At RedState, they are fanatics about this sort of thing, but they are entitled.  They own the site.

I don't get to insult your house or your spouse/significant other and eat at your table.  That's not censorship, that's common sense and self-respect, especially if the comments do nothing to promote a party win in November.  MyDD and DKos are both really clear that they are Democratic sites, no deception about it.


by Crablaw on Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 11:38:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Just as I thought (none / 0)

I got auto banned by the same kind of NeoConestic types as the dKos diarist in question. Riddle me this Batman. Why do we, as liberals, progressives, Democrats, or whatever other label you'd like to throw in, even spend one minute of or precious time blogging? I don't know about you, but it seems to me that most of us have a shared sense of right and wrong, and I mean right and wrong in the larger context of behavior. I fight against the bully and for the "little guy." When I see authoritarianism I call Bullshit on it. When I read comments like yours, I wonder what you are all about. The dKos diarist in question has finally made public what has been going on for a long time there; censorship through intimidation and abuse of power. Sound familiar? The dKos diarist in question may be a great guy in reality. I know he's passionate about his ideals, and I may even enjoy his company over a cold beer, as I may enjoy yours. We all want the same thing as far as the big picture is concerned, but I will not stand idly by while people who rail against the Bush Administration, Karl Rove, the NeoCon agenda, and the NeoCon mentality, employ the very same tactics against their own. And I'm speaking of the larger issue that has been happening for some time. The issue that the diary brought out exposes the seamy-white underbelly of dKos and those there that participate and condone that behavior either openly or by their silence and inaction. Markos and all the other blog owners cannot abdicate thier responsibilities with the argument that it's an open community and also state that they own the site and can do as they see fit. My argument on this issue is, and always has been, that the powers that be at dKos and all the other blogs that make up the Left, need to take a stand on this issue in favor or against, and not abdicate their responsibilities if they, and you, or I, expect to be taken seriously by the world, and the MSM, at large. You cannot have it both ways. You cannot decry Karl Rove or George W. Bush, and then endorse like behaviors in your own backyard. My very personal view? Shit or get off the pot, or Lead, Follow, of get the fuck out of the Way.


"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe." - Albert Einstein
by A Patriot on Sun Sep 24, 2006 at 02:57:03 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Just as I thought (none / 0)

May I suggest the following:

1)  Paragraph breaks make writing easier to read, and therefore more persuasive.  

2)  I don't know you so you wondering or knowing "what I am all about" is not on my radar screen.  I wonder what you are all about but that's not relevant either.

3)  "rail against the Bush Administration, Karl Rove, the NeoCon agenda, and the NeoCon mentality, employ the very same tactics against their own."

I think that there is a very large difference between what you named on the one hand, and banning the use of a Democratic Party resource (as Kos pays for it to be) to run down general election candidates and the Democratic Party on the other.  You speak in such gross generalities that one cannot make sense of what you have said.  

It is not "Rovian" or "NeoCon" to refuse to subsidize the destruction of your own interests; it is the common sense of all mentally healthy adults not to subsidize their own opposition.  When you use Kos' bandwidth and memory to cut down the Democratic Party during a general election, you are asking him to pay (bandwidth charges) for you to destroy his interest (Dem electoral success in 6 weeks.)  So he is right to tell you to take a hike.

4)  If you don't like DailyKos, you are free to compete with Kos.  Go spend $8K a month on servers, go lose your family life talking with politicos, book publishers and tech people. Put Kos out of business with your superior site.  If I like it I will drop in.  Kos is not God, not even approximately.  

Markos Moulitsas does not owe you or me a damn thing.  Neither do the owners of this site.


by Crablaw on Sun Sep 24, 2006 at 03:37:25 AM EST
[ Parent ]

You're correct (none / 0)

I am aware of how to break up my paragraphs so that is my bad. Sorry.

I certainly do wonder what you are all about and to not ask that question of anybody you are having a conversation with denotes some kind of separation between who you are and what you write. I don't make a distinction. It also takes the human side out of any discussion and therefore, IMHO, is very relevant.

I have made precise comments and not, as you say, "gross generalities." I'm sorry I haven't gone back and dug out precise comments for you. To make that statement in and of itself is a gross generalization. How about a precise example. I don't think the behavior of the Bush Administration or the NeoCons is general in any way. It is very specific to say the least.

Also, if dKos and MyDD are mere tools for the their owners, then they are being disingenuous of how they represent themselves, period, end of discussion. In the real world, it's called false advertising or just simply lying.

Your fourth point is so absurd that I don't really know what to say except grow up. It's an immature and ludicrous statement. You might as well say if I don't like it to take my toys and go home. Put up or Shut up right? The blogs are meant for people to share opinions. My view is that if the owners want to run them like a dictatorship then at least be honest about it.


"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe." - Albert Einstein
by A Patriot on Sun Sep 24, 2006 at 04:24:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Just as I thought (none / 0)

Newbie, you cannot troll rate (or up-rate) your own comments on Scoop, which runs this site and DKos.


by Crablaw on Sun Sep 24, 2006 at 03:38:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]

What in the hell (none / 0)

are you talking about? You sure lost me. And please, the newbie bullshit is so condecending.

had to go back and see what you were referring to in my post.Obviously you didn't read it very closely.

I suggested creating a new account to see what life's like on the opther side. You don't seem to grab that coincept, so I'll leave it at that.

Your comment was surely in the Go F Yourself category. I really don't want to go there.


"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe." - Albert Einstein
by A Patriot on Sun Sep 24, 2006 at 04:32:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Boy (none / 0)

Too tired. Mucho Typos.


"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe." - Albert Einstein
by A Patriot on Sun Sep 24, 2006 at 04:39:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So this is Progressive Thought? (none / 0)

I don't get to insult your house or your spouse/significant other and eat at your table.

Most people don't put their home and family online.

Indeed you are right that MyDD and DKOS have a perfect right to select who they will allow to post and who they will not.

I am delighted that A Patriot was allowed to voice his complaint on MyDD.  

You are free to judge that A Patriot must have done something terrible to be banned or whatever happened on DKOS and I am free to judge you as having proven yourself a conservative toady who should never be allowed on a jury for making such an assumption without any other evidence.

This has been a most enlightening thread and a credit to MyDD.

Best,  Terry


by terryhallinan on Sun Sep 24, 2006 at 02:00:34 AM EST

Re: So this is Progressive Thought? (none / 0)

That was obviously not meant in response to the diary by A Patriot.  Sorry for screwing up.

Best,  Terry


by terryhallinan on Sun Sep 24, 2006 at 02:02:20 AM EST

Blog Games (none / 0)

You know, as a person posts more and more on any particular site, that person has made a considerable investment, and by all rights, should glean some equity there -- All other legalistic considerations notwithstanding. I am tempted to create a whopping political site where everything is just as murky and Byzantine as it is on these Scoop / Netroots sites, and then play the most convoluted mind-games imaginable on my constituents. Now here is something you can try, and might find interesting -- Grab a copy of the freeware progie 'PeerGuardian' at: http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles .php?group_id=131687 Then, install that sucker (it will function as a 'secondary firewall', and was designed to protect peer-to-peer music downloaders from detection by greedy copyright enforcement agents. I does something to block the enforcers from snooping, but it also fingers the enforcement agencies. It can be run during ordinary web surfing as well, and will detect other kinds of snoopers too!!! Like for instance, when I run it while attempting to access boomantribune, it informs me that the Democratic Party Committee is watching me!!! So, yeah, be paranoid -- be very paranoid. (Besides, it's much more fun to be paranoid than to be parapohobic.)
by blues on Sun Sep 24, 2006 at 08:09:09 AM EST

Re: Blog Games (none / 0)

OOPS! I had the 'HTML FORMATTED' flag stuck in my preference box, which made my post into one big single paragraph. That preference box at the bottom of the post is a total pain in the rear -- it really should default to 'Auto Format' upon each new post. But it don't!


by blues on Sun Sep 24, 2006 at 08:18:45 AM EST
[ Parent ]


You are not logged in.

In order to post a comment, you must be logged in. If you have a member account, please log in to comment.

If not, you can make an account right here. It's quick and free.

Login
Username:

Password: